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THE RECTOR AND HIS SON: CONVERSATIONS ON CERTAIN CHURCH AND STATE QUESTIONS.

I. ON THE ENDOWMENT OF ALL RELIGIOUS COMMUNIONS.

TWELVE months ago we gave to our readers, as some of them may remember, a conversation between a Rector and some of his young friends on the present confusions in the Church of England. It may be necessary to preface the following conversation with the statement that Hugh is the son of Dr. Burke, Rector of St. Guthlac's, and has just returned home after taking his degree at Cambridge with considerable distinction.

To the disappointment

of his father, however, he could not be
induced to sign the thirty-nine articles,
and was thus precluded from taking a
fellowship, of which he would otherwise
be sure.
The narrator is the Rector's
nephew, and from his narrative we
shall be able to give our readers other
conversations on kindred subjects.

One day Hugh and I were stopped unexpectedly in High-street by a young French gentleman, who expressed himself ravished and enchanted to meet his old friend Hugh again. Hugh told me afterwards that his French friend, M. Laville, had been introduced to him at Cambridge, where he had resided during part of the time that Hugh was there. Hugh asked him home, and as we were sitting after dinner, he said to Hugh, with a curious look, half of fun, and half of sympathy:-"And is it true, my friend, that you have still the 'téte moutée;' that you are still rebel to your good rich mother Church? Oh, my good friend, I was desolated indeed to see you abandon such prospects as they told me you had, all for an idea." "But, Monsieur," said Hugh, "did not France make war for an idea?"

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Ah, bah, mon ami, that might look very nice and heroic on paper, for those who have what you English call 'green

much, oh very much, wiser in his gene-
ration than you, my friend. His idea
was solid. It meant Nice and Savoy
for France, and a blow for Austria, to
keep her away from Rome. That I can
comprehend; you are beyond me. But
why do you not try the French system?
That is the true philosophy; pay the
preachers all round; all the priests, all
the rabbis, all the reformed pastors,-
Lutherans or Calvinists, or Baptists or
Quakers, or fire-worshippers; provided
only these last are not incendiary in
their ceremonies. Pay them all, my
friend, and you make them such excel-
lent subjects. Every one of them will
remark to his own heart now the
State is my very good patron, it gives
me wherewith to pay my board, and
lodging, and washing. I must be very
attentive to the wishes of such a kind
friend. I should be profoundly ungrate-
ful if I were not; and I might lose my
salary too, and then how should I pay
my board, and lodging, and washing?"
I have one objection to your plan,"
said Hugh, "which is this, that if I
paid for any religion, I should like to
pay for the right one. Now, if you pay
all forms of religion, you may pay the
right, but you must pay the wrong
too."

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"Oh! but I am of a larger charity than that. I please myself to think that they are all right in their own little way. I say to myself, ah, there are more roads to Heaven than there are to Paris. You do not imagine, my friend, that none will get there but those who travel in the same train with you?"

"I never held such an idea for an instant," replied Hugh, "but remember that all the roads to Paris, though different, lead to the one centre-Paris. Now, suppose a new geographer gets

in their eyes; but M. Bonaparte is up, and asserts that it is entirely a mis

take to suppose that Paris is the capital of France, that it is a small town somewhere in India or China or Central Africa; it is more than probable that his disciples would go a good many different roads, each of which led away from Paris, not to it. So, in religious matters, one may hear different teachers (each of whom looks from a different point of view,) give directions which differ widely from each other, but which, nevertheless, point towards the central figure of true religion-Christ: but I am afraid there are other teachers whose advice would lead men who followed it as far astray as the geographical blunders I imagined about Paris would do. The final decision as to who are right and who are wrong must rest with God alone: but, this is a logical certainty, that two opposite assertions cannot both be true; and, as it is not in the power of the State to decide between them, the simple and sensible course is to let them all alone, to stand or fall by their own merits."

"Think, though, my friend, must you not now and then 'to do a great right,' do a little wrong? Look at your poor Ireland, for example. The Roman Catholics are now nearly eight times as many as the Protestants. Your Government took away their churches and their revenues, and now it makes the eight people pay for the church and the priest that the one only goes to. Oh! but that is a grand spectacle! it is so just― it is so generous! It says to Dives, here, my dear-here is more purple and fine linen, and more good things to eat. It says to Lazarus-you get out-you go to your dogs. If I were an Irish Roman Catholic, how I would love and honour England for making me pay for what I would not have as a gift. Now, even if it would be just a little wrong for a Protestant government to pay one set of men to preach Popery, and another set to preach Protestantism, would it not be so very, very right and good to give back to the Roman Catho

lics a little of what you have taken from them; and would it not make the good fathers so happy and contented when they see the State disposed to 'level them up' to an equality with their heretical confrères? Would not these great goods make up for any tiny little evils that they might involve?" "I have not," said Hugh, 66 one word of defence or excuse for the establishment of the English Church in Ireland. I do not approve, as you know, even of the establishment of a Protestant Church in Protestant England. All objections to a State Church in England hold equally good in Ireland, while there is in that country not even the excuse sometimes made for the establishment here—that it provides a church for the poor; for, in most parts of Ireland, an immense majority of the poor will have nothing to do with it. This monstrous injustice keeps up a constant sense of wrong in the minds of the Roman Catholics, and engenders, no one knows how much of malice, and all uncharitableness, on both sides. The only right and wise course, as far as I can see, is simply to abolish the Irish Establishment, making, of course, such provisions as would secure from loss those who now hold office in it, and have therefore a vested life interest in it. As for paying the priests, I doubt whether they would so far forget the claims which their Church makes, as to stoop to be paid. If they did, I believe they would bring upon themselves the scorn of all other Catholics, for condescending to sacrifice their independence, in order to get money from a State which they believe to be heretical. You must make men loyal by being just to them; not by bullying them first and bribing them afterwards. Give equal rights to Protestants, Roman Catholics, Jews, to every man, in fact, without respect to his creed, and then there is no excuse for disloyalty."

“Ah, my friend, you are no better; I fear, your symptoms are rather worse;

is thrown away. So adieu, топ

and that, on the whole, your case is hopeless; and so all my excellent advice

ami."

II. ON STATE PATRONAGE, AND WHAT IT DOES FOR THE CHURCH.

A DAY or two after the discussion just mentioned, I went with Hugh to call on one of his father's friends, Mr. Easton, a goodnatured, elderly man, of good education and fortune; long retired from business; who had adopted high art as a hobby; and sometimes vexed, and sometimes amused my uncle, Dr. Burke (whose church he attended), with his advice as to the proper art adornment of his church. He seemed very glad to see Hugh, and, after begging us to admire a very grimy little picture of a dirty, snuffy-looking old woman's head-a great prize-a real Rembrandt, he turned to him and said, "You can't think how I have been longing to see you, my lad. You know I have a natural taste for curiosities of all sorts, animate or inanimate. I look at them with the eye of a connoisseur, and I think I am pretty keen in my judgment. Years, oh! years ago, I said to your father, 'Now, my dear sir, that boy of yours has talent-decided talent, sir; there's something original in him. I can see it as clearly as I see the original touch in my Raphaels and Rembrandts; but, my dear sir, you must be careful, he has a tendency to odd ideas;' and now, my dear boy, do let me hear all about it."

"I am afraid I should tire you," said Hugh.

"Not in the least, my boy. I am a regular old Athenian, and like to hear some new thing."

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especially, I see so much that I think wrong, that I could not honestly avow myself to be one."

“Oh! what a pity, what a pity; don't you think you could look at it a little differently? Why hundreds sign who don't believe half as much as you do. I am sorry. I thought you had got bitten with some of the interesting heresies of the present day, and that if you didn't bite it would be curious to watch

your odd ways. But, oh! you poor boy, you won't find people half so ready to make allowance for your becoming a Dissenter, as they would be for your becoming anything else in the way of unbelief. It is not 'ton' now, as it was some fifty years ago, to affect an elegant scepticism about all sacred things; but let me warn you, you may be as big an infidel as you like, and people won't think you the least bit the less of a gentleman therefore; but with society in general you will lose caste dreadfully by leaving the Church on any other plea."

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'Well, sir, if it be so, I must bear my fate, and I hope I shall survive it."

"But tell me, what is the matter with the Church, that you cannot belong to her any more?"

"There are many things in the prayerbook to which I could not give my assent, as I must have done had I gone on to take orders, as it was intended I should do; but the connection of the Church with the State seems to me so utterly unscriptural, that I could not belong to a Church thus constituted."

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Now, my boy, I'll put it to you from a new stand-point. You know an elderly gentleman, who has seen a good deal of the world, takes a more practical view of these things than the clergy. Look at it now from a high art point of view. You know my reverence for art, and how Place it above money, rank, place, I

power; above any earthly thing you like to mention. But let me ask you, what would art itself be without patronage? The artist I look on as the great man; the patron, though a rich man, may be a very little man, but still the one cannot do without the other. The higher must be supported by the lower. So I think it the duty of the State to be a munificent patron of religion, and to clothe the Church with that wealth and dignity which give so much importance to the cause which they adorn; to place its ministers in good positions, and to ennoble its officers, so that the best blood in the land need not be ashamed to belong to it. Did you ever give sufficient weight to these considerations ?"

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But, sir, I think that all their weight goes into the scale against the patronage of religion by the State."

"My dear boy, you astonish me; you do indeed. Pray consider my nervous system; I am not so young as I

once was.

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But what can you mean?"

This, sir; that you have no more right to use illegitimate means to support religion, than you have to use false evidence, and illogical reasons, to support a truth which you find it difficult to prove."

"Oh, my lad, I am afraid much learning has made you-ah- too particular. What can there be illegitimate in holding out the prospect of wealth and power as an inducement to first-class men to enter any profession? You don't think it's wrong for a young man to go to the bar because he sees a vision of himself, in mature life, wearing the ermine of a judge; and then, a little later on, in the robes of a Lord Chancellor. Then why should it be wrong for another young man to take holy orders, because, in like manner, hope has told him a flattering tale, as to how she saw him in a

mitre and lawn sleeves, and heard him make such beautiful speeches in the House of Lords."

"I do not," said Hugh, "think the motives you mention illegitimate ones for entering any profession, except the highest and most sacred of all, that in which a man devotes his life to the service of God and His Church. They are quite adequate to make a man work hard and steadily. They are perfectly lawful, for they urge a man to aim at objects which in their right place are themselves good; and, if a man strive for them fairly, trying to win them by deserving them, the very effort after them will make the man better and more useful, even if he fail, as he most likely will, to attain the height of his ambition but any selfish motives, or any motive short of a supreme desire to promote God's work, must be inadequate to make a man what he ought to be in the service of God. If a man is looking constantly for some prospective worldly advantage from his work, he must lose sight of his real reward, the glory of winning souls for Christ. While, as to entering the Church from such motives, it seems to me that the State, in offering "great prizes," which are attractive to all men, godly or ungodly, tempts men to the commission of a sin, for which I should not like to try to find a name; when it is remembered that every candidate for deacon's orders has to state solemnly that he trusts that he is inwardly moved by the Holy Ghost to take upon him that office."

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forms of service, which the State Church must enforce. Men seem to lose sight of the evil of solemnly stating that which they do not wholly believe. How this system blunts and dulls the fine sense of honour, is continually seen in the manner in which many clergymen object to use, but nevertheless do use, the same solemn words of confident hope over the graves of all men alike-the same for the believer, who, after a holy life, dies in humble faith in his Redeemer, as for the unbeliever, who, after a life of vice, dies asserting that he has no soul, and that there is no God. They do not believe what they say, and yet they say

it."

"But," said Mr. E., "you would not surely wish to require a clergyman to pronounce by implication his opinion as to the eternal state of the departed."

"No, indeed, sir; nothing could be further from my wishes. It is just this very pronouncing an opinion to which I object. It is not for us to judge the dead. That awful prerogative belongs only to God. There can be no want of charity in simply saying nothing on the matter, while there does seem to me a want of truth in expressing hope and trust for which there is no basis. Yet the State makes the clergy do this whether they like it or not."

"Ah, well, my boy, a great deal that you say sounds very true to me, but I hardly know if I fully apprehend all you mean. I have been walking a good many years in the old ways, and one does not easily get out of the beaten path, along which one's ideas have travelled so long."

"I hope, sir," said Hugh, "you won't think me too dogmatic."

"Oh no, my boy, not the least. I like every one to speak out; and if you'll come back to the Church, which I'm afraid you never will, and if I get any influence with Government, which I am sure I never shall, I will try and get them to make you a Bishop."

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Thank you, sir," said Hugh. "I

can say Nolo Episcopari, without any mental reservation. Good bye."

When we got home, we saw that something had occurred at which my uncle had been very much annoyed. "What's the matter, father?" said Hugh.

"Matter!" he replied; "I haven't been so vexed for I don't know how long, as I was this morning with Mr. Ketcham, a member of Sir George Chancey's election committee, who called to tell me that Dr. Twoshoes was dead, and his archdeaconry desolate. He first preached a short funeral sermon on the virtues of the deceased, and on the importance of having a fit successor. Next he deplored my blindness to the merits of Sir George, as a guide, philosopher, friend, and champion of the Church, and hinted at the powerful influence that he might exercise in the making of the new appointment. Oh! I can't tell you half he said; but he crawled and coiled round and round about the subject, till I lost all patience, and said, "Pray, sir, do come to the point; don't be afraid of hurting my feelings. What you mean is this (though I feel sure you are not commissioned by Sir George Chancey to make any such offer), that if I will ‘rat, and vote for Sir George, you think he will do his best to put me in the place of the late lamented Dr. Twoshoes." Then, oh! he hoped I would not misinterpret his motives-he should have been-what I forget, but he implied that his earthly happiness would have been complete if he could have secured my vote and interest for Sir George; but he knew the delicate sense of honour which, &c., &c., high principle, &c., and so on, till I was almost sick. He hadn't the grace even to be savage with me for what I said. Oh! what a sin and shame it is that holy things should be hawked about, bartered, and sold! The sin of those men was great, who sold sheep and oxen, and changed

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