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not the cause of the increase of crime. It was true, that crime had increased; but it arose from other causes than the Game-laws. The right hon. Secretary of State for the, Home Department had stated, that in this metropolis, one person out of every two hundred and eighty-three was annually charged with some crime or other; and yet the county of Middlesex was that in which, of all others, the offence of poach

to interest so many in the preservation of been said, that they, by means of the the game, that it would induce them to Game-laws, were promoting the extension destroy the foxes. But it ought to be of crime. He believed the charge to be observed, that fox-preserving was break-unfounded; and that the Game-laws were ing of the law; and that, in order to enjoy the sport, the hunters were obliged to conciliate the good wishes of their neighbours. He would be extremely sorry to do any thing that would materially interfere with their amusements: but he was persuaded, that there was nothing in this bill that would materially affect those who were fond of fox-hunting, and that it would not lead to the destruction of the foxes. The small landlord, as the lawing prevailed the least. Petty larceny was stood at present, was doubly annoyed; first, because he could not touch the game on his own land; and next, because the game destroyed so much of his corn. He knew a very worthy man who was so much struck with the annoyance which he and his neighbours suffered in this way, that he poisoned a part of the corn on which the game was most likely to feed.-Grant only that the present state of the law was an evil, and it followed, that something ought to be done to apply a remedy; and as to the foxes, he would have no objection that the law, instead of offering a reward for killing them, should make their destruction penal, provided he could carry the measure now before them into effect. -Having gone through the objections, he had only further to say, that the eyes of the country were on their lordships, and that it would be a most serious disappointment to multitudes of most excellent and public-spirited persons, if their lordships should reject the bill. He entreated their lordships to vote for the second reading, and when they came to the committee, he should not be unwilling to modify its provisions, as far as might be consistent with the preservation of the principle of the

measure.

The Earl of Malmesbury apologised to their lordships for obtruding himself on their attention so often in opposition to this measure; but as his noble friend persisted in his plan, and had now, for the sixth time, brought the subject under their lordships' consideration, he felt himself called upon to oppose it. He was as little disposed as his noble friend himself could be, to yield to public clamour; and he would not be biassed by it on the present occasion. He knew that there was, at this time, a great run on the country gentlemen; and, among other things, it had

perhaps the nearest in its nature to poaching; and that had increased to a very great extent as well as poaching, but it was not owing to the state of the law, but to other causes. One cause of the increase, of petty larceny as well as of poaching was the want of employment for the people. Another great cause of the increase of poaching was the remarkable facility which had taken place in the communication between the different parts of the kingdom. Owing to this circumstance, it was astonishing at what a cheap rate and with what rapidity a basket of game, as well as he who had it to dispose of, could be carried from one place to another. A hare might be shot on his noble friend's ground on Saturday, and be eaten by a London alderman on Monday. Another cause of the increase of poaching was the increase in the population of the kingdom, and in its wealth and habits of luxury; and another cause was the cheapness of spirits. That cheapness led to drunkenness, drunkenness to idleness, idleness to temporary want, and that to crime. The haunting of public-houses was, in his opinion, one great cause of the increase of poaching. He was aware that some were of opinion, that the open exposure of game to the poacher, with such a temptation to violate the law as existed at present, and the open exposure of poached. game for sale, had a tendency to demoralise the people. But the tendency to demoralisation was not greater than that which was occasioned by his noble friend, when he walked up and down St. James'sstreet with a Bandana handkerchief hang-,{ ing out of his pocket, which presented no small temptation to the pick-pockets to seize it. Nor was the tendency greater than that which was presented in Monmouth-street, where a man could not walk

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the foot-path without rubbing his nose against a pair of trowsers. The proper mode of proceeding was, to make the law get rid of the crime, and not allow the crime to get rid of the law. He decidedly objected to the diminution of the privileges of the country gentlemen, as rendering them less disposed to reside at their country seats. As to the increase of the qualification, he might have consented to try it, as an experiment for two or three years, although he thought it very doubtful whether it would answer; and he had proposed, last year, to separate the bill into two but the result was such, that he would not attempt the same thing this year. Indeed, the two subjects were so blended in this bill, that it would not be easy to separate them. He rather wondered that his noble friend had not adverted to the report made by the magistrates of Southampton on the subject of the Game-laws. That report had induced him to write to the clerk of the peace for that county for a list of the commitments for poaching, and the offences most nearly resembling it, for five years, from 1824 to 1828, both inclusive; and the return was this-In 1824, the number committed for offences against the Game-laws was one hundred and twenty-two:-for deerstealing, ten; for fish-poaching, four; and for fowl-stealing, eight. In 1826, the number committed for offences against the Game-laws was one hundred and eighteen, exhibiting a decrease, while the number committed for deer-stealing was seventeen, for fish-poaching three, and for fowlstealing eight. In the last year the number committed under the Game-laws was one hundred and eighteen; so that there was a decrease under that head since 1824, while in the other particulars there was an increase; and yet the sale of venison, fish, and poultry, was legal, while that of game was illegal; and in reasoning from these premises, his conclusion was, that the legalizing of the Sale of Game would have no effect in diminishing the crime of poaching. The proprietors of twenty acres might, by this bill, give leave to sport on them, and it made no difference whether the acres were of moorish heath, or of the richest soil. On this plan, the proprietor of twenty acres might say to a poacher, "If any man challenges you for carrying game of any description, say that you got it on my ground, and with my leave, and that you are taking it to VOL. XXI.

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one of the licensed dealers." This would be a very convenient plan for both par ties; but it would scarcely tend to the diminution of poaching. And then, as to the licensed poulterer, there could be no doubt that he would purchase game from the poacher, from whom he could have it at a cheaper rate than from the legal seller. Poulterers would be driven to it; for when one did it, the rest must follow, otherwise they could not keep their place in the market. But his great objection to the bill was, that it would diminish the privileges of the country gentleman, and render them less disposed to reside on their estates. As the law stood, they had the opportunity of conciliating the good will of their neighbours, and these did not feel inclined to interfere with them or their friends in sporting over their grounds." But if the Sale of Game were legalized, a farmer, when his landlord killed game on his ground, would be apt to think that he was taking double rent; and he would' say, "Sir, I am very sorry, but if you sport on my ground I must have so much deduction from my rent, because I can now turn the game to account." The landlord says, "I cannot afford that;" and then the farmer replies, "then I can have a sportsman from London, who will readily pay the sum which I ask." This measure would totally alter the description of persons connected with the game. Sporting at present was a matter of amusement, but under this bill it would become an affair of money; and the country gentlemen, deprived of their former amusements, would leave their country seats, and flock to town. It had been said, that it was a libel on the country gentlemen to suppose that they would be driven from their mansions by the curtailment of such privileges as these. But gentlemen who resided all the year round on their estates required to have this privilege, to enable them to pass their time agreeably. Country gentlemen naturally looked for amusement in the places where they resided, and it could not be expected that they should amuse themselves by going through their fields with Aristotle in their hands. The amusement of pursuing the game was a healthy and harmless one, and ' one also which was very attractive. He thought it a wise policy to give gentlemen" a bonus to induce them to reside on thei estates. He was convinced that the passing of this bill would be attended with 2 S

evils much greater than anything it could put an end to. For these reasons he should vote against the second reading.

The Earl of Carnarvon supported the motion. If he really thought that the measure would operate as an inducement to the country gentlemen to abandon their mansions in the country, he would oppose it; but he did not think it would have any such effect. On the contrary, he was convinced that the present state of the law prevented many gentlemen from residing regularly on their estates, who would otherwise do so. As the law at present stood, neither magistrates, juries, nor gentlemen could do their duty, and were constantly compelled to violate it. This was a vicious state of things, and it was an object of great importance to remove that character from the law, and to bring it into a state in which magistrates, judges, and juries might administer it with satisfaction. The proper plan was, to make the law what it ought to be, and then to enforce it; and it was in order to bring it into this proper state, that he was anxious that this bill should be read a second time. There was nothing in the bill to curtail the amusements of the country gentlemen ; and why should they not sell their game? As to the illustration of the noble lord about people in walking along Monmouthstreet rubbing their noses against pairs of trowsers, these people would not be the less disposed to pilfer them, if they could get no trowsers to buy. As to the observations about the twenty acres of land, it would be open to any one in the committee to propose that the number should be increased. But, at the same time, this bill would not enable any unqualified person to shoot even on the twenty acres. The true principle was, to put the law on a proper footing, and then to enforce it. But, as the system stood at present, princes and peers, and many gentlemen of large fortune, could not enjoy the amusement of shooting game without a violation of the laws. He certainly had no fear that foxes would be destroyed in conse quence of the passing of this bill. If their lordships wished to put an end to poaching, they must give a legal market for the purchase and sale of game. If they did not do this, the market must be supplied by crime. The greater freedom they gave to the supply of game, the less would be the temptation to poach, and the

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The Marquis of Londonderry said, he did not see any occasion for allowing the bill to reach a committee. If he thought any advantage could be attained by that means, he would not oppose it; but he was satisfied of the contrary. The noble lord said, that the bill had been passed by an unanimous vote of the House of Commons. But he reminded the noble lord, that a similar bill had been rejected by the Lords. He did not think that legalizing the sale of game would diminish poaching, or produce the other good effects of which it was supposed capable. In Germany, the sale of game was permitted; notwithstanding which, there was just as much poaching in that country as ever. He would vote against the second reading.

Their lordships divided: Contents, Present 59: Proxies 20-79. Not Contents, Present 42; Proxies 27-69. Majority for the second reading, 10. The bill was then read a second time.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.
Monday, May 11..

WOOL TRADE.] Sir James Graham said, he had to present a petition from the landowners and others of Cumberland, complaining of the great depression in the price of British Wool, and of the distress which they laboured under, in consequence. The petitioners attributed these evils to the large quantity of foreign wool imported into this country; and the prayer of their petition was, that the House would re-impose a higher duty on foreign wool sufficient to amount to protection. He was bound to state, that he differed from the view which his constituents had taken, both of the causes of the evil, and of the remedy for it; but, at the same time he could bear testimony to the fact, of the existence of the distress complained of. He thought, also, that there was something anomalous in this; namely, that the grower of the wool told them he was selling his wool at a price infinitely too low, while the manufacturer declared that he was working up that wool almost at a loss. When he considered the depression which prevailed generally in the

dices, thought such a protection necessary, and referred to the tariff promulgated by the American government, in support of his assertion.

manufacturing and agricultural interests, and the time at which that depression had come; namely, at the period in which the bill of the right hon. gentleman (Mr. Peel) opposite had come into full operation-he Mr. V. Fitzgerald said, there would be thought himself justified in asking, whether no difficulty in shewing, that the object there was not some justice in the predic- which the hon. member had in view in protions of those who said, that the measure posing a tax on the importation of foreign of the right hon. gentleman would en- wool would be entirely defeated by the imhance the value of money by contracting position of such a duty. Indeed, a duty the currency, and that the consequence of that kind would have just the contrary would be confusion and distress in all effect to that which was required. The branches of industry. This, however, was examination taken before the committee of not the time to discuss this subject; yet he the House of Lords last year, afforded the could not resist the opportunity of pressing best evidence upon the subject. The upon the House the consideration, whether duty which, within these few years, had this question was not at the bottom of our been taken off, was not, it should be recoldifficulties. He could not help observing lected, one under which the British woolupon the injustice of attempting to pay in growers had gained wealth and importthe present currency the interest of a debtance; since it had been imposed only in contracted during the existence of a de-1819, by the present lord Bexley, for the preciated paper currency. Was it not alarming to reflect, that out of a revenue of fifty millions, we had not more than sixteen millions applicable to the current service of the year? These were matters which it was the duty of ministers to take into their most serious consideration; for now that Ireland was pacified, all other questions sunk into insignificance in comparison with them. He would remind hon. gentlemen opposite of the conduct of the late lord Londonderry, who, in 1822, when the contraction of the currency, had caused considerable distress, came, with his wonted firmness of character, down to the House, and proposed to legalise the circulation of small notes until the year 1833.

Mr. Heathcote said, that wool which had formerly sold for 58s. was now selling for 23s. Long wool had been excluded from the inquiry of the House of Lords last year; but the subject was to be brought forward again in that House by a noble duke, and he trusted that some hon. member would call the attention of this House to it.

*Colonel Sibthorp hoped that ministers would take into their deliberate consideration the whole state of our agricultural and commercial interests before the rising of parliament.

purpose of making up a sum of three millions for the support of public credit. With respect to the allusion to the United States tariff, he would wait to see the effect of the principle of that law on American industry before he pronounced an opinion upon it. He must, however, say, that America was the last country to whose mercantile policy he should have expected a reference to be made, particularly by so acute a person as the hon. member.

Mr. Attwood said, he had merely stated the fact, without pronouncing an opinion with respect to it.

Mr. F. Lewis said, that the American tariff could not exclude British manufacturers from America; for, if goods were manufactured more cheaply in this country, they would by smuggling overcome the obstruction offered by the tariff, and penetrate into the northern provinces of America through our colonies.

Mr. V. Fitzgerald hastened to disclaim the ground of argument used by his right hon. friend as a motive with the government, while, at the same time, he would admit the correctness of the fact.

EAST RETFORD.] Mr. G. Lamb rose, to renew the request he had made with respect to the notice standing for that evening relative to East Retford. The bill Mr. Attwood thought there ought to be was now in the hands of the hon. member some means of protection afforded to the for Hertfordshire, and he would put it to British wool-grower, and some tax imposed that hon. gentleman, whether it would not on the importation of foreign wool, for that be lost time to continue the proceedings on purpose. He remarked, that other na-that subject during the present session? tions, the least bound by ancient preju- The period was past when any bill could

Mr. N. Calvert agreed with his hon. friend as to the very little hope of carrying any bill through this session; but he could not take upon himself to abandon it, unless it was the general opinion of the House that he ought not to proceed. If his right hon. friend (Mr. Peel) would not think that he acted unfairly towards him, he would acquiesce in the request of the hon. member for Dungarvon.

be introduced; and he thought the opinion | back to the system of borrowing money to he had expressed the other night, that the pay off debt. He knew there was great hon. gentleman had better postpone his difference of opinion as to the mode in measure till the next session, was corro- which the surplus revenue should be apborated by the proceedings that then took plied, but he thought that in one thing place, and also by the new shape which every body was agreed, and that was, the question had assumed by the new bill that it was not good policy to borrow to be brought in by the hon. member for money to apply it to the payment of debt. Hertfordshire. At the same time, he was What was the state of the case? The not insensible to the wish that must na- right hon. gentleman had estimated the turally be felt by the House, that some surplus revenue of this year at three milend should be put to the discussion of lions; and wished to pay off three millions this apparently endless question. of unfunded debt. The way in which he proceeded was, by making a loan in order to purchase the Exchequer-bills, and then, at the close of the year, he applied the surplus of three millions to purchase the stock thus created. He could not go along with the right hon. gentleman in his feeling of injustice in paying off the Exchequer-bills at the premium at which they were sold in the market. The country was bound by its engagements, and so should individuals be bound by theirs to the country. It was easy by giving notice, as in the case of a loan, to obviate any objection on the score of injustice. When so large a sum as eighteen millions was subscribed, and the scrip rose to a premium of two and a half per cent, it was evidence of the facility with which the transaction could be effected. Though he disapproved entirely of this mode of funding Exchequer-bills, he would not apply to it the same expressions which had been made by an hon. member on Friday. He would not apply such terms as “profligate" to what he believed was done for the best. He would not, therefore, divide against it.

Mr. Peel was of opinion, that there would not be time, during the present session, for carrying through any measure with respect to this borough. In that case, he thought discussion of the subject would be an unnecessary waste of time. He, there fore, as an individual, joined his wish to that of others, that the measure might be postponed to next session.

Mr. N. Calvert said, that under these circumstances he had no objection to postpone his motion; at the same time giving notice, that he would bring it forward at an early period next session.

Mr. Tennyson hoped it would not be understood that this arrangement would leave open the question of the new writ; for certainly if it should be moved this session, he should oppose it.

Dr. Phillimore thought, that some understanding should be come to as to that point.

The debate on the motion, "That leave be given to bring in a bill to prevent Bribery and Corruption in the Borough of East Retford," was then adjourned till this day two months.

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The Chancellor of the Exchequer said, that if he could not convince the noble lord that the bargain was one advantageous for the public, he could but acknowledge the candid and liberal feeling in which the noble lord had stated his objections to it. The bargain, he contended, was a beneficial one for the public. It was doing no more on the part of the country, than an individual would do, who, having a number of bills outstanding and payable on demand, should give for them a mortgage on his property. The debt in either case was not paid, but its nature was changed. If any apprehensions existed at having so large a sum outstanding payable on demand, that apprehension would be removed by this operation of funding, and in the way in which

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